tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9203077889905915553.post399644705158830232..comments2023-10-30T04:06:45.798-07:00Comments on arduous blog: The New Economyruchihttp://www.blogger.com/profile/17043512641324366469noreply@blogger.comBlogger14125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9203077889905915553.post-4776085289822592842008-05-15T11:59:00.000-07:002008-05-15T11:59:00.000-07:00GB, very good point. We HAVE to transition, becaus...GB, very good point. We HAVE to transition, because our current economy isn't sustainable forever. Better to do it now.<BR/><BR/>Shannon, I am not so sure a regressed economy is the answer. The problem is that if we hit a major recession or depression, people are going to turn to the cheapest available energy source we have: coal. That's (part of the reason) why I support a strong economy, I just support a new economy.ruchihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17043512641324366469noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9203077889905915553.post-60841159891022827502008-05-15T11:37:00.000-07:002008-05-15T11:37:00.000-07:00Oohhhh.......great post! I think an "evolved" ec...Oohhhh.......great post! <BR/><BR/>I think an "evolved" economy is incredibly smart. Nothing can keep growing and growing - unrealistic. <BR/><BR/>Maybe I just have a little utopian dream about what we could be. <BR/><BR/>I think a regressed economy could actually help with so many other environmental factors and certainly with our unchecked population growth. Limits to ourselves is not necessarily the worst thing.Going Crunchyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01885445987575778289noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9203077889905915553.post-61357156021561298952008-05-14T22:34:00.000-07:002008-05-14T22:34:00.000-07:00Very good point. I think we can start to move tow...Very good point. I think we can start to move toward a different type of economy. One more based on services, experiences, and, as Burbanmom said, used goods, local foods. It is a transition and sometimes those can be a bit bumpy but I think we will all be a lot better off. Heck, if we don't transition, we'll just be off.Green Beanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03133847111288382381noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9203077889905915553.post-72297141087932069892008-05-14T14:51:00.000-07:002008-05-14T14:51:00.000-07:00Burban & Beany I agree. We're still going to want ...Burban & Beany I agree. We're still going to want to spend what we earn so our economy will naturally evolve.<BR/><BR/>Orgie, yes, I'm with you. Saving for the future is a positive economic choice. Weird that we almost demonize it in America.<BR/><BR/>Beany, I have heard of localharvest, but I don't know if I've spent much time at the site. I'll look at it.<BR/><BR/>Jennifer, I have never slept on money, but yes, I have a feeling it would be uncomfortable!! ;)<BR/><BR/>Cindy W, I think you are right to a certain extent. I am not an economist either, but I know that there is growing concern that while globalization has bettered the lives of a small percentage of people in the third world, it has worsened the lives of a much larger percentage. Something to do more research on.<BR/><BR/>Leila, actually I believe both savings accounts and stocks expand the economy. (As long as your savings acct is in a bank.) Savings accounts don't reduce the supply of money because when you put your savings in a bank savings acct, the bank turns around and loans the money to someone else. <BR/><BR/>Ecoburban, totally understood the cake thing. I get you. I think you're right. I am happy we are moving towards an experienced based economy. I think we'll be happier to spend our money on experiences rather than things anyway.ruchihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17043512641324366469noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9203077889905915553.post-20255197690344177292008-05-14T12:33:00.000-07:002008-05-14T12:33:00.000-07:00OK - that was long and the example of cake doesn't...OK - that was long and the example of cake doesn't really represent the whole economy, but it could be a model for how we buy lots of things, no? Cars, houses, clothing? Tons of really cool "vintage" clothing stores in hip neighborhoods are really just selling used goods! :o)EcoBurbanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14931648017376435556noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9203077889905915553.post-18685071099948577932008-05-14T12:31:00.000-07:002008-05-14T12:31:00.000-07:00You are so right - we are moving to an experience ...You are so right - we are moving to an experience economy. The way I see our economy as it pertains to a birthday cake:<BR/><BR/>In the early 1900s we were agrigarian - if you needed to make a cake you had to get eggs from a chicken, milk from your cow and grind your flour.<BR/><BR/>Then came the industrial revolution and WWII into the product age and we were introduced to the Betty Crocker Cake Mix to make our lives easier - we bought products that made us feel better or equal to other people.<BR/><BR/>Following that we moved into the service economy where you ordered a cake from a bakery or a specialty shop and had it delivered to your house.<BR/><BR/>Today, the acutal birthday cake is just a small part of the party - You have an experience with the cake - a cupcake decorating party for kids for example.<BR/><BR/>So, the acutal product is not what people buy these days, it's the feeling or fun or experience they have with the cake. The cupcakes can be homeade, storebought or designer - no one cares. They talk about the 7 different colors of frosting at the party or the unique sprinkles and candies for the top etc.<BR/><BR/>Whether the product is new, used or from a thrift store, do you have a story to tell about what you experienced? I know I for certain have many, many more stories and experiences to tell since I embarked on the local challenge. I can tell you about our local soap maker who named her soap after her grandfather or the bakery that makes homemade cannoli shells and will fill them on request or my funny juice glasses from the thrift store with the strange numbers on the bottom that my kids created a game around. I don't have many stories to tell about the perfectly matching boring juice glasses from Target!<BR/><BR/>Great Post Arduous!!EcoBurbanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14931648017376435556noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9203077889905915553.post-87461720071200136342008-05-14T10:18:00.000-07:002008-05-14T10:18:00.000-07:00I think I learned in economics that saving reduces...I think I learned in economics that saving reduces the overall supply of money (and hence constricts the economy) while investing in stocks keeps it in circulation and expands the economy. But I do agree that buying useless stuff is not good for the economy. Debt is bad, foreclosures are very bad. So how can overextending your credit to buy xmas presents, etc possibly be good? I would say that spending in general is good for the economy, but only as long as you are spending on investments and assets and services and not on throwaway "stuff".Leilahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/00370390118007858451noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9203077889905915553.post-25622845466438252232008-05-14T10:05:00.000-07:002008-05-14T10:05:00.000-07:00Excellent post. Though not an economist, I still b...Excellent post. Though not an economist, I still believe that transitioning from product-consumption to service-consumption is beneficial in many ways - supporting local economy, reducing raw material usage, continuing quality of life, just to count a few. <BR/><BR/>A lot of times, inertia prevents us from changing to a better direction. Economists have been so wrong so many times in the past.<BR/><BR/>The one point I want to elaborate on is the argument of our impact on economy in other countries. Immediately, yes, if we stop buying cashmere from China, the cashmere industry there will suffer. If we stop buying coffee from Columbia, the coffee growers will suffer. But shouldn't countries be responsible for its own livelihood? Before globalization kicked into full speed, Columbian people lived their lives and Chinese people lived their lives. I am not against trade. Trade is as old as human kind. But the way we are trading now effectively destroys the ability for some countries to survive on its own. <BR/><BR/>Additionally the cost of labor will eventually level out as developing countries enter the developed world. It is highly important for the countries with cheap labor to figure out solutions when that the leveling out eventually happens. It will probably be sooner than we can anticipate.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9203077889905915553.post-77236259189214410912008-05-14T06:16:00.000-07:002008-05-14T06:16:00.000-07:00Cheating? How can you cheat on something you crea...Cheating? How can you cheat on something you created when you are following the rules YOU created? People are funny.<BR/><BR/>I must say, I agree with you. We all have money to spend... and spending money in any way will affect the economy. Unless you hoard it under your bed and don't let it ever get out, you are going to help the economy... plus money is lumpy to sleep on after a while. (Though you could put it in Chile's plastic buckets).<BR/><BR/>Savings helps, buying experiences helps, buying used even helps. So many other possibilities!Jenniferhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17377889829748572675noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9203077889905915553.post-28048673572512494302008-05-14T05:00:00.000-07:002008-05-14T05:00:00.000-07:00It _is_ early.Regarding yer list...you have heard...It _is_ early.<BR/><BR/>Regarding yer list...you have heard of localharvest.org right? They have listings for restaurants, grocers, farmstands, etc, etc. I don't know how often its updated, but based on the results you get you can google the business names to get more info (like to see if they're still in business).Samhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03068855919147458057noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9203077889905915553.post-23912350670655021342008-05-14T04:47:00.000-07:002008-05-14T04:47:00.000-07:00OK...there are like 10 typos there...but you get t...OK...there are like 10 typos there...but you get the point. It's early people.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9203077889905915553.post-54568828206787247012008-05-14T04:46:00.000-07:002008-05-14T04:46:00.000-07:00Saving more for your future vs buying crap you don...Saving more for your future vs buying crap you don't need now is more that economically responsible. Max out that 401K! I'm not quite sure how all these people who spend everything they make on junk without thinking of what they are going to do when the money is no longer coming in are planning on supporting themselves....oh wait...they're not. How is sucking the inadequate system dry exactly good for the economy? <BR/><BR/>As to the cheating thing...it is always amazing how people who do NOTHING positive like to poke holes in people who do SOMETHING positive. You are creating real changes in your life, like you said, many of which you can maintain without being miserable. You are changing what defines your happiness. Another reason I love your approach; you really do things for genuine progress.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9203077889905915553.post-91997523087187282532008-05-14T04:03:00.000-07:002008-05-14T04:03:00.000-07:00I shouldn't post this since my own livelihood is a...I shouldn't post this since my own livelihood is at stake but...I am not sure I want to live in a world where the "service" sector contributes 78.5% to the GDP. I think we can stand to have a change in the composition of the GDP. I don't know if I want the economy to keep growing...I don't see what good has come out of this growth besides various groups of people being shat on at some point or the other. I'm with burbanmom in that the economy (this wondrous god that everyone worships) will just evolve into a different beast if everyone quit being buying shoddily constructed goods made in third rate conditions.Samhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03068855919147458057noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-9203077889905915553.post-35908799136959745632008-05-14T03:25:00.000-07:002008-05-14T03:25:00.000-07:00Yeah, I disagree with those economists who say tha...Yeah, I disagree with those economists who say that if we all stopped buying so much new shit our economy would tank. I think it's BS. Our economy would <I>evolve</I> into something different. As you said, an experience-based economy; a fine, local food economy; a used-commodity economy; even a trip-to-the-moon economy (not that I'm promoting that!). People in America like to spend what they earn and that won't change. We just need to change what we spend it on.Burbanmomhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03482218254218777985noreply@blogger.com